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	Comments on: Update on Ecuador and the ATPA	</title>
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	<link>https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/</link>
	<description>The Blog of International Judicial Assistance</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 22 May 2013 13:42:37 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Ted Folkman		</title>
		<link>https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1330</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ted Folkman]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 May 2013 13:42:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lettersblogatory.com/?p=14369#comment-1330</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1328&quot;&gt;Aaron Page&lt;/a&gt;.

I will take a look at the links if I get a chance later today. If you want to email me separately with corrected links, that would be helpful.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1328">Aaron Page</a>.</p>
<p>I will take a look at the links if I get a chance later today. If you want to email me separately with corrected links, that would be helpful.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Ted Folkman		</title>
		<link>https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1329</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ted Folkman]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 May 2013 13:42:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lettersblogatory.com/?p=14369#comment-1329</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1327&quot;&gt;Aaron Page&lt;/a&gt;.

No worries!

Maybe this is simplistic: isn&#039;t the answer that Ecuador should have made the human rights arguments to the arbitral tribunal? Maybe the tribunal got the issue wrong, but that&#039;s the risk you take when you agree to arbitrate. It&#039;s not as though there are two competing orders out there, one compelling Ecuador to suspend the judgment and one compelling Ecuador &lt;em&gt;not&lt;/em&gt; to suspend the judgment. There is only one order out there, so it seems to me that Ecuador&#039;s obligation is clear. I get the point that due to Ecuador&#039;s internal law Ecuador says it could not comply with the order. That&#039;s precisely the situation the US found itself in in the &lt;em&gt;Medellin&lt;/em&gt; case. But don&#039;t you agree that impossibility that stems from domestic law problems (federalism in &lt;em&gt;Medellin,&lt;/em&gt; separation of powers in this case) doesn&#039;t relieve a state of its international law obligations? Again, maybe this seems to simplistic, but it seems like a pretty simple issue to me.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1327">Aaron Page</a>.</p>
<p>No worries!</p>
<p>Maybe this is simplistic: isn&#8217;t the answer that Ecuador should have made the human rights arguments to the arbitral tribunal? Maybe the tribunal got the issue wrong, but that&#8217;s the risk you take when you agree to arbitrate. It&#8217;s not as though there are two competing orders out there, one compelling Ecuador to suspend the judgment and one compelling Ecuador <em>not</em> to suspend the judgment. There is only one order out there, so it seems to me that Ecuador&#8217;s obligation is clear. I get the point that due to Ecuador&#8217;s internal law Ecuador says it could not comply with the order. That&#8217;s precisely the situation the US found itself in in the <em>Medellin</em> case. But don&#8217;t you agree that impossibility that stems from domestic law problems (federalism in <em>Medellin,</em> separation of powers in this case) doesn&#8217;t relieve a state of its international law obligations? Again, maybe this seems to simplistic, but it seems like a pretty simple issue to me.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Aaron Page		</title>
		<link>https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1328</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Aaron Page]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 May 2013 12:48:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lettersblogatory.com/?p=14369#comment-1328</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Also the links (which I think you formatted?) in my original post are a little messed up....]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also the links (which I think you formatted?) in my original post are a little messed up&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Aaron Page		</title>
		<link>https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1327</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Aaron Page]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 May 2013 12:47:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lettersblogatory.com/?p=14369#comment-1327</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1326&quot;&gt;Ted Folkman&lt;/a&gt;.

Ok&#8212;the &quot;scroll down&quot; explanation didn&#039;t occur to me, so my apologies.  It is indeed an old debate at this point, although it&#039;s frustrating that I don&#039;t believe I&#039;ve seen a substantive response anywhere from Chevron or its lobbyists and professors, or from the international arbitration community, as to what the Ecuadorian court ought to have done in the face of the conflict between human rights and investment law obligations that it identified.  The suggestions are simply (i) pretend a conflict doesn&#039;t exist, pure head-in-the-sand; or (ii) just submit to the demands.  Neither takes the issue seriously.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1326">Ted Folkman</a>.</p>
<p>Ok&mdash;the &#8220;scroll down&#8221; explanation didn&#8217;t occur to me, so my apologies.  It is indeed an old debate at this point, although it&#8217;s frustrating that I don&#8217;t believe I&#8217;ve seen a substantive response anywhere from Chevron or its lobbyists and professors, or from the international arbitration community, as to what the Ecuadorian court ought to have done in the face of the conflict between human rights and investment law obligations that it identified.  The suggestions are simply (i) pretend a conflict doesn&#8217;t exist, pure head-in-the-sand; or (ii) just submit to the demands.  Neither takes the issue seriously.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Ted Folkman		</title>
		<link>https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1326</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ted Folkman]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 May 2013 18:29:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lettersblogatory.com/?p=14369#comment-1326</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1325&quot;&gt;Aaron Page&lt;/a&gt;.

That&#039;s a fair point, Aaron. The truth is I didn&#039;t realize you could &quot;scroll down&quot; on the docket page I was looking at and didn&#039;t see the other comments! I have, however, covered the Ecuadoran perspective on this issue &lt;a href=&quot;http://lettersblogatory.com/2012/09/24/lago-agrio-wheels-of-government/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow ugc&quot;&gt;previously&lt;/a&gt;. I wish you would not attribute nefarious motives to me, but I suppose that&#039;s up to you!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1325">Aaron Page</a>.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s a fair point, Aaron. The truth is I didn&#8217;t realize you could &#8220;scroll down&#8221; on the docket page I was looking at and didn&#8217;t see the other comments! I have, however, covered the Ecuadoran perspective on this issue <a href="http://lettersblogatory.com/2012/09/24/lago-agrio-wheels-of-government/" rel="nofollow ugc">previously</a>. I wish you would not attribute nefarious motives to me, but I suppose that&#8217;s up to you!</p>
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		<title>
		By: Aaron Page		</title>
		<link>https://lettersblogatory.com/2013/05/20/update-on-ecuador-and-the-atpa/#comment-1325</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Aaron Page]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 May 2013 18:16:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lettersblogatory.com/?p=14369#comment-1325</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[How on earth is it fair and objective to cover this issue by linking to and quoting from Chevron&#039;s submission, while simply ignoring the directly &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.regulations.gov/#!documentDetail;D=USTR-2013-0018-0036&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow ugc&quot;&gt;contrary submissions&lt;/a&gt;and the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.regulations.gov/#!documentDetail;D=USTR-2013-0018-0087&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow ugc&quot;&gt;Ec plaintiffs&lt;/a&gt;?  The comments from Ecuadorian and American small businesses (apparently considered as acceptable collateral damage by Chevron in its pressure campagin against the ROE) are important, but as used here they just add to the appearance that you went out of your way to cover all viewpoints, when in fact you did not.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How on earth is it fair and objective to cover this issue by linking to and quoting from Chevron&#8217;s submission, while simply ignoring the directly <a href="http://www.regulations.gov/#!documentDetail;D=USTR-2013-0018-0036" rel="nofollow ugc">contrary submissions</a>and the <a href="http://www.regulations.gov/#!documentDetail;D=USTR-2013-0018-0087" rel="nofollow ugc">Ec plaintiffs</a>?  The comments from Ecuadorian and American small businesses (apparently considered as acceptable collateral damage by Chevron in its pressure campagin against the ROE) are important, but as used here they just add to the appearance that you went out of your way to cover all viewpoints, when in fact you did not.</p>
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